6. Homer Kelley told me personally that he chose the Head because "if you move your Head you can see more under the Ball." He also said there could be problems with using 'between the shoulders' as a center, but he did not elaborate. That discussion was recorded.
Do you think that Homer would change his mind on this subject in later editions if he was still around???.
__________________
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What I should have said is that I personally would like to hear more than "This is what Homer said in The Golfing Machine."
Again....Homer IS the man.....but I would like to know more before I regard having a completely Stationary Head and a Tripod (head exactly between the feet) as something which ALL golfers must attain (even though it's not an Imparative).
I know Homer has done all these years of research...etc. etc. etc. so maybe everyone should just believe him. Maybe that's what we should do.....
.....but I dunno.....
....Brian seems to really believe in what he's saying.....and much more importantly, I believe he does have something in his argument. It is a reasonable debate IMO.
...
Lynn- do you have any reasons why you think Brian is wrong based on your OWN experience (teaching experience especially)?
I suspect you must have something.
Last edited by birdie_man : 01-05-2006 at 04:38 PM.
BTW, I think if you and Brian could both lay out exactly what you think in one plane that would greatly clarify what’s what been going on in the recent threads on this topic.
Here are a few things that we should know:
-Tripod (head directly between feet) ALWAYS?
…exceptions?:
-Stationary (no Sway) ALWAYS?
…exceptions?:
-What’s ideal? Anything?
OR…in which circumstances is WHAT ideal?
-Through neck centre viable option as part of PERMANENT procedure?
…or only to “train pivot” or w/e?
Do you think that Homer would change his mind on this subject in later editions if he was still around???.
The Golfing Machine® as we know it was the labor of genius for forty-two years.
The Stationary Head as the Pivot Center was a bedrock point from which that genius never varied.
So, do I think Homer Kelley would have switched to a Non-Centered Pivot over the last twenty years?
No.
In fact, he codified the Pivot Center concept in the as-yet-unpublished 7th edition as the Pivot Swing Center Tripod.
Do I think he would have embraced a different Pivot Center?
No.
Remember, his primary reference during the early years was Ben Hogan's Power Golf, the very same text from which photos have been extracted to build a case for the 'between the shoulders' Pivot Center.
Would he have changed his mind had he found evidence to the contrary?
OK. I am posting this not necessarily to further this debate but for the benefit of those interested in Mr. Kelley's position on the Head as the Pivot Center.
Since this is a Forum and website devoted to the advancement of G.O.L.F. I will bore you or engage you (depending on your voracity for reading the Yellow Book) with the areas in which the word "head" is mentioned in the 6th edition of The Golfing Machine. These quotes have been taken out of context so I hope that they will not be misleading as a result. I think these quotes are illustrative on Mr. Kelley's position. Anything not in bold is MY OPINION and to be interpreted as such.
As stated, the Stationary Post is defined in 1-L titled MACHINE CONCEPT. Here we are told that the player is to view his body as a "machine" which of course is the central thesis of the work.
1-L MACHINE CONCEPT
1. The Stationary Post (player’s head) accurately returns the Clubhead through the ball (Centered Arc).
2. The Post may turn (Pivot) but does not “sway” or “bob.”
The word HEAD next appears in Chapter 2: Statement of Principle. The word PRINCIPLE is defined as "A rule or law concerning the functioning of natural phenomena or mechanical processes." So in Chapter 2 Mr. Kelley is stating what he believes to be the rules governing the Machine's operation.
The Mechanics of Golf is the production and manipulation of the “Line of Compression.” Precision is recognizing and reconciling minute differentiations
A. The Three Basic Essentials are:
1. A stationary Head
Per the above the Mechanics of Golf is about STLOC and Mr. Kelley believed the Stationary Head to be ESSENTIAL to this process. Essential is defined as "Basic or indispensable; necessary." Imperative is defined as "Having the power or authority to command or control." Therefore the Stationary Head doesn't have the power to control the LOC. However, it is indispensable. So pretty important?
So on we go to the next HEAD . . .
2-H SHOULDER MOTIONS
The spine, between the shoulders, is the center of the Shoulder Turn only, not of the Left Arm, except by specific extension of the Swing Radius. Because, Swinging from the Wrists, the Left Shoulder, the Right Elbow, the Waist or the Feet, show it to have just to many exceptions. Though the “Head” Pivot Center is recommended, it is not at all mandatory.
But the Shoulders do have crucial On Plane functions – synchronizing and aligning the Pivot Motion and Thrust with those of the Power Package (Chapter 6). “On Plane” Right Shoulder Motion is possible only by titling its axis – the spine.
Being a part of the Pivot and the Power Package, the Right Shoulder must reconcile them by moving with the greatest precision for thrust, speed, direction and distance. (7-3) So the Right Shoulder does not flap around haphazardly – it has many responsibilities. And variations in its Impact location will vary the Right Elbow’s Impact Bend and so may alter the Impact alignment of the Clubface.
So in the section above, Mr. Kelley explicitly states that the "Head" Pivot Center is RECOMMENDED but not NECESSARY. Please notice the sections in red. I think this will give you an idea of what the "Head" Pivot Center relates to . . . the mission critical functions of the club being On-Plane, the alignment of the Clubface, and the location of the Right Elbow.
Does this mean that movement of the head could impact the following? being On-Plane or off-plane? Low Point? The alignment of the Clubface? Draw your conclusions . . .
2-J-1 IMPACT ALIGNMENTS
Clubface alignment also includes the requirement that the center of the Clubhead arc be so located that the Clubface strikes the ball before it strikes the ground. If the Clubface is centered on the ball while soled behind it any distance whatsoever, the radius of the Clubhead arc must be shortened or the Club will meet the ground precisely where it had been soled. This procedure of shortening the radius of the stroke is popular – that is pulling in the Hands at Impact by raising the head and shoulders a guess-timated distance, or pulling back the Left Shoulder, or bending the Left Arm, all with that same “precision.”
The word HEAD again appears in Impact Alignments, a section of obvious importance. It seems that via section in red, a head that moves results in a shortened radius and thus a loss of precision in Impact Alignments, the title of this section. This goes a long with the next place HEAD appears, Bobbing.
3-F-7-C BOBBING is raising and/or lowering the Head by faulty movement of the back or knees, and disrupts the Shoulder-to-ball radius.
7-14 HIP TURN The Hip Turn as a Stroke Component is strictly the product of the Knee Bend and the Waist Bend. Not otherwise could the weight be shifted and the Shoulder Turn Axis be tilted without moving the Head. A Hula Hula flexibility allows the Hips and Shoulders to be independent but coordinate and so avoid Right Elbow – and – Hip interference and its “Roundhousing” Throwaway (4-D-0) during the Start Down – the Delivery Line ROLL PREPARATION (12-3-22).
Except for its being, in itself, the Weight Shift, the Hip Turn is a motion permitting – rather than causing – the other effects, actions and motions of the Pivot. Weight Shift is strictly a HIP MOTION. Substituting a Head Motion and/or Knee Motion will make Swaying inevitable.
Per the above seems that Mr. Kelley felt that head movement has some serious implications.
7-16 KNEE ACTION Actually, the primary function of Knee Action – as with Waist Bend – is to maintain a motionless head during the Stroke.
9-1 ZONE #1 includes all the elements of Body movement and balance, and defines the geometrical alignments and relationships of the Body Components. The Pivot involves twisting the body and shifting the weight during the Stroke so as to maintain balance, a motionless head and any required tilt of the torso.
Per the above the "motionless head" is linked to balance, which of course is the 2nd BASIC ESSENTIAL.
AXIS TILT Example – pouring tea.
Mechanical – To change direction, the helicopter Pilot alters the plane of the rotating blades by tilting their axis in the new direction.
Golf – To change the plane of the Shoulder Turn without moving the Head, the golfer must tilt the Shoulder Axis by moving the Hips.
BALANCE Example – a hula dancer.
Mechanical – State in which all opposing forces cancel each other out. Golf – Holding the center of gravity of the body inside The Stance without moving the Head.
Again the "motionless head" linked to Balance i.e. the Second Basic Essential.
PIVOT Example – revolving door.
Mechanical – That motion of a body moving around a center point. Golf – A multiple universal-joint assembly between the Stationary Head and the Stationary Feet holding the Clubshaft “On Plane” by positioning and adjusting the Lever Assembly, through the #3 Accumulator, as directed by the Right Forearm.
Here the Stationary Head is linked to the clubshaft being On-Plane and to Accumulator #3 which of course controls Hinge Action which controls the Clubface which controls the golf Ball.
STATIONARY HEAD Example – a spinning skater.
Mechanical – Same as Pivot Center.
Golf – Chosing the Head – rather than Between the Shoulders as the Pivot Center.
So there it is as written by Mr. Kelley. It is my conclusion based on the above that the Stationary Head is Essential in the areas of being On-Plane, Clubface Alignment, Right Elbow Location, Balance, Low Point, the strokes full Radius, Full Lever Extension and a three dimensional Impact sustaining the LOC.
__________________
Aloha Mr. Hand
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Last edited by 12 piece bucket : 01-06-2006 at 12:01 AM.
-Tripod (head directly between feet) ALWAYS?
…exceptions?:
-Stationary (no Sway) ALWAYS?
…exceptions?:
-What’s ideal? Anything?
OR…in which circumstances is WHAT ideal?
-Through neck centre viable option as part of PERMANENT procedure?
…or only to “train pivot” or w/e?
Add if you care to.
Birdie,
I've already answered every single one of your questions. Please...
Read my posts.
The only thing remaining to be addressed are your words 'ALWAYS' and 'exceptions.' To this I say, there are ALWAYS exceptional circumstances: Some situational. Some physiological. And some psychological.
Life is short. Play hard.
And take my advice:
1. Set your Head at Address where you want it to be at Impact.
2. Leave it there until at least the end of the Follow-Though.
Learn to do that, and then go to work on the Stroke itself...
3. Use your Right Forearm and #3 Pressure Point to Trace a Straight Plane Line with the Clubhead Lag Pressure and keep your Left Wrist Flat through Impact.
That is what this System is all about. Once you have the fundamentals down pat, everything else is a distraction.
I dont think anyone would argue that - if you built a machine that needed precision and compression, the less lateral movement, particularly from the base, the better. And so...I believe Mr Kelley was dead on in this respect. This is a precision game - and the less wobbly parts, the better. Common sense.
However. I believe Brian has a point as well, and it shouldnt be dismissed. I do not know of a player whose head does not move - not saying there isnt one, I just havent seen it. And in this regard, I see Brians point. I wouldnt say its optimal to move the head (and havent seen Brian say it either), but many, if not most, players do.
There is the optimal way - which maybe many of us cannot do, and there are other ways, no? (which I wouldnt necessarily call optimal, but maybe more realistic).
Just my take. I'll stand with Homer on optimal...but also understand other points of view...
Linear Mode
