Ok, I'll go back. But the first thing I'm going to say is: "O.B. Left over at LBG.com said all of you suck!". Then I'm going to give them your address, phone number and make and model of your car. I'll be back in five minutes. It will take that long to post this message on 5 of their most recent threads.

OBfuscatory Patrol
 

OB needs a giant wooden spoon for Christmas...for better "stirring" potential:naughty:

Back to Dragging the Wet Mop?

I guess any release can sustain the Lag. Drag the Wet Mop.

followers suffer from "Asperger's Syndrome", a mild form of Autism. His diagnosis was performed from information he learned while reading the new "Golfing Machine" Biography

I gotta read this, is this at Erickson's site or iseekgolf?

I'm embarrassed that I started out defending him as a fellow TGMer. We all make mistakes, but I sure had the wrong picture of what was happening. When I read his latest comments about YODA and followers of TGM, I got physically sick.

Kevin

Erickson's website. ISG.com wouldn't allow crap like that on their website. I haven't been back to Ericksons site since my "meltdown" so I haven't read his latest criticism.

I found a description of our disease. I think it describes O.B. Left really well.


(*) just kidding.

The Fifth Element
 

Hey I developed my 5th accumulator and my Aspergers went away! :salut:

Yaaa, the 5th Accumulator. I forgot about that. I can't remember what gets accumulated?

Its interesting to me how TGM has a tendency to divide into various factions. The history of this, I dont fully know or understand. Its probably an old sore spot for many of the early A.I.s.. A rehash would be painful and serve no purpose I guess.

Some have chosen to navigate these troubled waters by relying on Homers words. Some have taken an opposite approach. Some cling steadfastly to particular variations. Dialogue should bring new insight but instead it brings disharmony it seems. Homer imagined a network of A.I.s but acknowledged that each would have a unique understanding of TGM. The internet makes this more likely and brings with it a chance for information exchange and tremendous growth like never before. There are far more TGM knowledgeable golfers out there now than at anytime in the past. Homers vision is starting to happen. A day will come when the golf magazines and teachers will be talking about the geometry that we are familiar with. The facts and illusions,etc. It will happen, I believe. Not a revolution or anything just an evolution of popular perception. It wasnt too long ago that "Straight back, straight through" putting was considered the ideal plane of motion for instance. Arcs are everywhere now. Lynn wrote of the geometric differences between the two conceptually years ago, the advantages and disadvantages of both. Submitted it to a major golf magazine actually, which chose to not publish it as a letter to the editor even. His letter would be as accurate today as it was then, only now it would probably get published. Things are changing, slowly, to my mind. The putting arc is just the start to a common understanding of the full swings geometry. The geometry of the circle. If you can understand that little arc you must wonder about the rest of it, no?

As for Lag's site, Homer and Lynn would, I believe, support "his way" or any "my way" for that matter. Perhaps Lag's former teachers didnt, I dont know. That wouldnt surprise me. But Homer would support it only to the point where it ceased to be his "my way" and became "the way". Homer wouldnt have mentioned "X Procedures" if he hadnt considered their viability, their existence for instance.

I liked Johns writing, his reflections, his passion. But Im saddened that he chose to attack Homer and Lynn. Im amazed actually. Why attack the most inclusive, the most variation savy amongst the clan? Its his loss, really. I hope his pattern works well for all who try it. That would be a first for golf, however.

Great Post!

There are so many wonderful teachers and patterns out there that we can all learn from. We all feel YODA and ALIGNMENT GOLF are at the top of the list, but many others have a lot to offer as well. Why can't we just all get along?

Where Is The Love?

Kevin

D, you morphed this thread into Meat Ball Methods, didnt you. Bagger aint gonna like this.

And all this time I thought you were looking for some new spaghetti recipes. Or variations. TGM is not a cook book you idiot.

You will be set adrift, to live in eternal damnation amongst your friends on the Advanced B.S. website. And, May G.O.L.F. have mercy on your poor pathetic soul.

Have you told your Wife?

Aye, he was interesting at first. What happened? Now, he seems to have a 'chip on his shoulder'. I guess being on a TGM website for almost two years will make anyone kinda crazy. Especially while people are trying to itemize a "Stroke Pattern" for his "Swing Method". That could force anyone who thinks they have something new to offer, to go over the edge. Now, he babbles and needs Therapy. Man; "Another one bites the dust" http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rY0WxgSXdEE.

He could be pis_ed off because Nancy Pelosi is his Congresswoman. ??



The only "Post" mentioning "Method Golf" in this thread was written by you.

Hmm? Chapter 7: Ingredients ............... Chapter 10: Ingredient Choices


I signed you up at "Advanced B.S." Website. Use your normal User name (O.B.Left) and your password is "idiot".

GREAT NEWS: you have a "Reply" to your first "Post". It says:

Wow. Your first reply. Congratulations.

That's what I say.

Ya had me at "Alignment Golf". But I agree.

I'm with you there Kev and said as much on Lag's site.

Kevin,the love is in the almighty dollar as usual. If you are trying to push a pattern, you are selling. Homer Kelley called his book a tool box, meaning there is something in the book for all patterns. Unfortunately, a lot of internet sites push a method of some sort, a pattern that is superior. They pick out golfers who have never won major tournaments and prop them up as models. LBG instruction creates athletic, golf like movements, whether swinging or hitting. If you cannot claim superiority, you won't sell. Unless what you provide is not sales but information, like we get here. If our agenda is making golfers better, of course we would get along. If we are trying to sell a pattern, watch out. If we could transport some of these guys back in time to teach Jack Nicklaus at Scioto when he was 16, do you think he would have been a better golfer? I'll stick to the yellow book, study my alignments and work on my swing, not Moe Normans.

Moe told someone, cant remember who:

"Dont swing like Moe. Swing like you".

Kevin you are the nicest man I know!

The essence of "love" is destroyed by rendering love common place. Every system (golf or otherwise) is implictly exclusivistic. However, not all systems are equal...some have closer correspondence with reality than others. Acceptance is not to be confused with toleration. Tolerance is a myth. I reject the "can't we all just get along?" mantra. Let us scrap it out...the last idea standing...wins! Nothing free about love my friend...it makes it's own demands. Unity of thought is for utopian suckers! Again...I say let us scrap it out! Bring it...big boy...bring it! Insert smiley.

Thats it. The sound you are hearing is a big can of whoop-ass opening. I'm getting your address from Bucket!

Kevin

Kevin is awfully nice. My guess is he toughens up when you are asking for strokes. Hope we find that out in the spring.

Dodger, I like your sentiments, the only problem is that most on here agree that if Yoda got hold of Tiger then 50 majors would be realistic.

I laso agree with Okie that one of the best ways to settle any argument is the old line - "Show me your medals"

the sad truth is that with the exception of Brian Gay, there are no professionals winning events (never mind majors) who will say "I owe it all to Homer Kelly".

Whatever we want to believe about sing theory, it is whoever gets it in the hole in the fewest number of strokes that wins the prize. We can wax lyrical about Stuart Appelby's positions, but the truth is, that there are no TGM'ers winning week in week out.

I am not sure that is the point of Homer's book or of Yoda's great instruction here. I agree with you GPS about the lack of players advocating TGM. But, look at their swings. Lets take Lucas Glover, US Open champ. Lag, flat left wrist at impact, float loading... He has components we can see in his swing that are in the book. So does every player on tour. Mr. Yoda knows the book and can teach. These are two separate things. If I get my daughter, who is just learning to play, to move her hands through impact before the clubhead, she will get a flat left wrist. I am not teaching her from the book, I am using the toolbox Homer Kelley provided to give her alignments that are golf like. Swinging left is a prime example. Kevin taught me to swivel after followthrough, really improving my swing. The swivel takes the club left, which is nothing more than being on plane. Teachers still need to be able to teach, regardless of what they know. Communication. Yoda has it, so do other teachers.
I think if you and I took lessons side by side, Yoda would tell us different things, that is teaching. Putting every student into a pre-conceived model is not. I find it hard to disagree with the Yellow Book when I see its examples in every tour player. Tell me one tour player that does not exhibit the three essentials or the three imperatives. Does the golfing machine have a player endorsement? Every good one. Tiger, regardless of swing change, has a steady head, flat left wrist, lag... Like Patton said about Rommel: " You magnificent Bast###, I read your book." Maybe Tiger didn't read it, but his swing is in the yellow.

The book has every room for every swing Dodge, from Tiger down to the 18 Hcap hacker.

IMHO Tiger would be even better if he spent a weekend or two at the swamp

No argument GPS, he would improve and eliminate the really bad shots like he hit on the 18th hole yesterday.

Golf Swing is only part of a Pro Golfers makeup. The world is filled with great Ball Strikers.

Snap Release

Attachment 2114

Blood and Guts
 

Well said, dodger. Thanks!

While I'm at it, and this is an unabashed threadjack having absolutely nothing to do with golf . . .

A big Thanksgiving Thank-You to:

The late General George Patton (that self-described "Son of a Goddamned bitch, Georgie Patton") http://www.geoffmetcalf.com/patton_20010914.html . . .

The U.S. Third Army http://www.arcent.army.mil/. . .

And to all our courageous U.S. sevice men and women and those who have gone before -- expecting little and sacrificing much -- all while securing for "we the people" the liberty we enjoy today.

I understand that, in this 'new age' of entitlement and "Entertainment Tonight", these kudos rankle.

For those so affected, get over it.

From those of us who have served . . .

And from the countless beneficiaries who cherish their freedom; who 'get it'; and who stand strong . . .

We say:

Be very careful.

Those who would risk the United States of America to achieve their own personal, political or religious ends are treading on hallowed ground.

And there are many of us, indeed, a majority of us, who simply ain't gonna let that happen.

:salut:

"Read the Bible every God Damned day of my life."

General George S. Patton on his religious beliefs.

Where were you born?

Welcome to the USA. The nice thing about Oklahoma, is that you if you travel 600 miles in any direction, you'll find civilization.

Fine Compliment
 

Funny, Daryl ! Civilization is overated! I have lived here for 16 years. First as a student, then as permanent resident..now as a "ballot brute"

No he wouldn't. The guy is just stone deaf or incapable of listening.

Eldrick's real problem is that he thinks he knows best.

Disagreement is not the same as Disrespect
 

This newbie enjoys the lively debate here because it is informative, objective, and often humorous. I’m learning from the exchange of ideas and contributions by more knowledgeable/experienced members (the tuition costs aren’t bad either).

FWIW Daryl, out of curiosity, I went lurking at the scene of the so called "melt-down"...wish I could get that hour back! The LBG/TGM thread, it seemed to me, was mostly a rant, filled with unfair and abusive posts from the same 2-3 people. I gave up in disgust. What does ABS actually have to offer? Never found out, the owner was busy bashing others.

Wisdom in the old joke; ‘Never wrestle with a pig. You get dirty, and besides, the pig likes it.’

Groverw,

Thank you for the impartial review. I couldn't agree more with the title of your post that "disagreement is not the same as disrespect".

The Right Approach
 

I have been chewing on this right elbow business and feel like there is a commonality between the best ball-strikers. None of them run out of right arm, in fact many of them (Trevino, Hogan) have a substantial amount of right elbow bend well after impact. I read a caption for a Hunter Mahan sequence that said something to the effect that the bent right arm "stabilizes the club face." The face flashes closed when the left wrist bends as a result of the right arm. I understand that hinge action is a function of the left wrist, I am refering to the influence the right elbow has on the #3 Acc. Daryl's rigid power package crusade helped me see this. Check out Furyk's at right elbow at end and impact! Amazingly there is not as much variance as you would think. My best swing thought EVER "Take the bend through the ball!" I may have the pull that has plagued me for 20 years whipped!

I agree Okie.

How about taking it one step further. The set up. In setting up the way YODA teaches, right forearm on plane, you have to lower your right shoulder at address to get there. The lower the right shoulder at impact, the less chance of running out of right arm.

Setting up with my COGs aligned, level and centered, I have the problem of running out of right arm.

YODA's set up ideas solve the problem, makes it a no-brainer...

Kevin

Phil
 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=woRsFpkzxZQ&feature=fvw
go to the 3 minute mark

I see flat left wrist, left wrist uncocking and lots of roll. The right arm straightening?

that is some great video, thats a lot of rol

Also look at his trailing Forearm at Impact. It's tracing the Plane Line and the #3 PP is pointing, RFFW, 3 feet ahead of the ball. The more bend in the Right Elbow, the farther ahead of Impact the #3 PP points and the more pivot/shoulder rotation is needed to keep On Plane.

I think whats important, is that the RFFW has a built in leading-tracing. See the Link below and watch carefully starting at 2:30 into the video.
http://www.lynnblakegolf.com/index.p...mp-Wedges.html


If you stand directly facing a player at Impact, the #3 PP will be ahead of the ball at impact and the Right Elbow will be behind the ball. (2 orange lines in the pic below)

The amount of Right Wrist bend determines the amount of Leading which in turn, determines the amount of bend in the Right Elbow to keep the Ball between the #3 PP and right Elbow. Then, the Right Elbow Location (how far away from the body the Right Elbow needs to be Located depends on Swing Plane Angle)is needed to Locate the RFFW On the Swing Plane at Impact.


This can be determined at Impact Fix. RFFW On Plane and tracing ahead of the ball. How much Bend in the Right Elbow, knees, hips, shoulder turn, etc.

The first part of the clip shows a unique view of the single shift TSP swing which many of us aspire to achieve.

I set up close to this and agree that it has real mechanical advantages. However, I prefer a slightly higher right forearm, knowing full well that address is NOT impact. I also have some convoluted applications with regards to "bobbing." I feel that I am not bobbing if my head does not move below "fix" at impact. The right shoulder has become my best friend. The trick was to have sufficient extensor action to make the power package rigid enough...to obey the lead of the right shoulder moving down plane. The deepness of the shoulder drive now conserves the right elbow...which in turn preserves the right wrist bend...which is the L-bracket for my flat left wrist. Like I said before a persistent pull-draw and at times a pull-hook pretty much ended any thought of me going to the "next level." The truth of the matter is that I just wanted to learn how not to do that as a matter of habit.