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Turned shoulder plane

During my GSEB this October I learned a turned shoulder plane to be a planeangle with static reference-points from adress. The static reference point was set after a horizontal line from the top of the right shoulder and back. Where another line from the plane line up through the right triceps met the first line is this referens point for the turned shoulder plane. When we looked at videos of a player at the top he had the hands in line with the right shoulder (before the course I would have called this a turned shoulder plane) and reached the static reference point for square shoulder plane but with a more rotated look to the shoulders we learned it to be a square sholder plane...!?

This confuses me a bit. Is turned shoulder plane a static plane or is every planeangle where the hands are in line with the right shoulder a turned shoulder plane. When I read 10-6-b I understand the turned shoulder plane to be a "flexible" planeangle?

Thanks:eyes:

Quote:

Originally Posted by acsweden (Post 47191)

Hello Anders,

At the Top, when using the Turned Shoulder Plane, the Hands, Right Shoulder and the Ball all lie in the same Plane. There can be Backstroke Shifts to this Plane (Single Shift / 10-7-B) or from this Plane (Double Shift / 10-7-C; Triple Shift / 10-7-D; and Reverse Shift / 10-7-E). To this extent, the Turned Shoulder Plane is "flexible", but there is no language in 10-6-B to that effect.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Yoda (Post 47192)

Hello Anders,

At the Top, when using the Turned Shoulder Plane, the Hands, Right Shoulder and the Ball all lie in the same Plane.

So it´s even a turned shoulder plane when using rotated shoulder turn as long as the hands, right shoulder and the balll lie in the same plane. Or am I completely on the wrong track here.

Anders ,what do you mean by a rotated shoulder turn?

The On Plane Rotated Shoulder Turn

Quote:

Originally Posted by acsweden (Post 47202)

So it´s even a turned shoulder plane when using rotated shoulder turn as long as the hands, right shoulder and the balll lie in the same plane. Or am I completely on the wrong track here.

The Rotated Shoulder Turn (10-13-C) can locate a Turned Shoulder Plane, but only if the Waist Bend is exactly right. I wrote a post a couple of years ago describing one way to determine the necessary amount of bend (and it's a lot). [Search my posts in the Archives for Rotated Shoulder Turn; I think I called it Shoot the Plane Line.]

Remember though, the true Rotated Shoulder Turn (in both directions) is effected by a Shiftless Hip Turn (10-14-C). This produces a Low Power Stroke that limits its usefulness to Short Shots.

Quote:

Originally Posted by neil (Post 47204)

Anders ,what do you mean by a rotated shoulder turn?

The shoulders rotating perpendicular to the spine.

Differentiating Shoulder Turn Variations

Quote:

Originally Posted by acsweden (Post 47235)

The shoulders rotating perpendicular to the spine.

If, after a Rotated (Backstroke) Shoulder Turn, the player shifts his weight left on the Downstroke -- a Hip Motion producing a Spine Tilt (lower portion toward the Target) -- then he has used the On Plane Shoulder Turn (10-13-D) and is no longer using the Rotated Shoulder Turn (10-13-C).

Quote:

Originally Posted by Yoda (Post 47207)

That's what I was getting at,maybe I should have asked "what do YOU [Anders] mean by rotated shoulder turn" .
I found when trying in vain to use this turn -on good shots it was actually an on plane turn on the way down.I found it was impossible to stay on the Rotated plane and hit the ball with any power:)

Ok. I thought a rotated shoulder turn always was both up and down. Thank you!