Okay, I am attempting to set up to the ball with my right forearm and shaft on the same plane. Let's call this the shaft plane. Now I know that I want the shaft to return to the shaft plane at impact. But, is the shaft to remain on this exact plane up and back? I know we want the hands on the 'turned shoulder plane' at the top, and the shoulder to come back down the shaft plane....so, at setup, should the shaft plane bisect the turned shoulder at the top of the backswing? Or am I confusing all the planes?
In a zero shift plane, the club would travel up and down the turned shoulder plane. In theory this is fine as far as delivering the sweetspot (a statement good enough for just now which is not quite true but unnessesary to add to the conversation), however the fact is that most clubs are not actually set up to be hit on this plane without tilting the clubface - one of the major directional factors. To exactly use the turned shoulder plane is not too easy in when trying to construct a model in terms of vector geometry yet the closer the golfer may come to this ideal, the less complicated the golfers alignments becomes.
In a zero shift plane, the club would travel up and down the turned shoulder plane. In theory this is fine as far as delivering the sweetspot
So to build a swing around this zero shift plane is okay, but that is a different plane than the shaft plane? If so, different but parallel? or just different?
So to build a swing around this zero shift plane is okay, but that is a different plane than the shaft plane? If so, different but parallel? or just different?
What I am saying is that the zero shift turned shoulder plane is an ideal. The closer one may become to that ideal the better from a pure mechanical perspective. However alot of golf clubs make it nessesary to be on a different plane than that of the turned shoulder plane at impact. Also a golfer is not as exact as a vector geometrical model I can draw. The main thing is to be 'reasonably close'.
Also, the shaft rotates around the sweetspot. The line of the longitundinal center of gravity stays on plane (which basically is a straight line from the butt end of the club to the sweetspot). The golf club is an instrument in which you weild its mass (clubhead) in space not the medium in which you connect with that mass(clubshaft). You draw a straight plane line with the sweetspot, not the clubshaft.
Different planes is different feel. Determine which plane you use up and down swing and as long as the plane line stays the same, its correct. There are many best ways around. if you lift and trace forearm,, zero shift easy. if you swing your club back , single shift easier .. And as long as the shaft head or Butt point on the plane line, it is on plane. Zero shift is Ideal.. however not everyone can get comfortable with it. Lynn, Hogan use single shifts..
Many here will agree using the turned shoulder plane is easier for downswing, in this case, the club shaft should feel to be disecting the upper arm in half during the downswing. And for Elbow plane, normally people with Pivot controlled swing will use that, this case the club shaft is inline with the forearm during downswing.
Use the lazer / torch line / plane board to correct your plane. Its a totally different point of view and feel. Thats why having a coach is much much easier to understand the concept.
I suggest you read the following article.. and look at the other plane articles by Paul Smith.
And in your swing have the idea to swing the clubhead, reproduce the angular motion/flat circular orbit,travel of the clubhead, and have this single, unique, unmodifying plane of motion the sweetspot moves along as a constant in your swing, while the clubshaft can do whatever chaos it wants, as long as you mantain this clubhead's sweetpot (monitoring by feeling the longitudinal centre of gravity's inertia, its resistance to motion, with ... I prefer the nº2 pp in the backswing). At some point, rotate/turn the left flying wedge so it would rest on/face the flat surface of the sweetspot plane of its angular 2 dimensional plane of motion.
"rotate the shaft around the sweetspot not viceversa", expresses the idea that sweetpot condition/motion direction is the constant, to have it as a fixed reference, while the shaft accommodates/varies about that constant, but never modifying that sweetspot/clubhead angular 2 dimensional travel, flat circular motion geometry.
This is how I see the "of an angular motion over an inclined plane" idea, if more experienced people on the golfing machine disagree, please explain because although it is a concise, complete, great yellow book, it is not as extensive, exhaustive on some concepts as many of us wish. So reading again, making some short golf strokes, reading some reference chapter, reading back again chapter 4,5, 2F,2K, chapter 1, and searching the forums, and have in mind "hinge action of the clubface, with the angular motion of the clubhead, over an inclined plane(shaft control, this may be still in incubation process)".
Very important, monitor what is happening to the golf club by the hand`s feeling, as it is the only way, we can only manage what we can feel (as with our body in other sports). Visually controlling it, as in eye-hand coordination is not very reliable, disastrous when seriously swinging.
In a zero shift plane, the club would travel up and down the turned shoulder plane. In theory this is fine as far as delivering the sweetspot (a statement good enough for just now which is not quite true but unnessesary to add to the conversation), however the fact is that most clubs are not actually set up to be hit on this plane without tilting the clubface - one of the major directional factors. To exactly use the turned shoulder plane is not too easy in when trying to construct a model in terms of vector geometry yet the closer the golfer may come to this ideal, the less complicated the golfers alignments becomes.
For zero shift, monitor the HANDS (pressure point #1) and move them on the turned shoulder plane.
__________________
"Support the On Plane Swinging Force in Balance"
"we have no friends, we have no enemies, we have only teachers"
Simplicity buffs, see 5-0, 1-L, 2-0 A and B 10-2-B, 4-D, 6B-1D, 6-B-3-0-1, 6-C-1, 6-E-2
For zero shift, monitor the HANDS (pressure point #1) and move them on the turned shoulder plane.
Actually Edz... A plane by defination is a flat surface in which a straight line can be drawn by two points. The key word here is two, not one, but two points.... pp1 and pp3.
However even this isn't true but accurate enough for golfers. Now heres a real head spinner for you. Pp3 isn't actually strictly speaking on the inclined plane except under a certain condition...
Actually Edz... A plane by defination is a flat surface in which a straight line can be drawn by two points. The key word here is two, not one, but two points.... pp1 and pp3.
However even this isn't true but accurate enough for golfers. Now heres a real head spinner for you. Pp3 isn't actually strictly speaking on the inclined plane except under a certain condition...
Yes - a line from PP#1 to the 'center' of balance. PP#3 'orbits' PP#1 and only PP#1 can stay 'on plane'.
__________________
"Support the On Plane Swinging Force in Balance"
"we have no friends, we have no enemies, we have only teachers"
Simplicity buffs, see 5-0, 1-L, 2-0 A and B 10-2-B, 4-D, 6B-1D, 6-B-3-0-1, 6-C-1, 6-E-2
Yes - a line from PP#1 to the 'center' of balance. PP#3 'orbits' PP#1 and only PP#1 can stay 'on plane'.
Congratulations....
So if your only using one point (pressure point 1) and the hands are strictly speaking going around the plane in a cone like shape around the line of the longitudinal center of gravity and therefore strictly speaking not exactly on the plane itself. Just tell me how on earth you expect by just moving pp1 up and down the turned shoulder plane is going to stop that club from being an infinate no. of planes???????????
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