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BerntR 02-19-2010 11:13 PM

Tigers remorse
 
So what do you think of Tigers remorse today?

I'll give it a B. The guts and the determination that went into it was A+, but the rest wasn't any good.

The performance didn't appear to come from the heart, and he seems to have a "I'll redesign my personality" approch to all of this which is not very trustworthy. Determination without reflection so to speak.

But he did take a clear position against his misconduct. Very few why's and absolutely no "I'll try"'s. If he falls back into bad habits it is highly unlikely that the press will hold anything back. I thought that was brave move. He is determined to conquer the challenge, but I don't think he has realized what he is facing yet.

bambam 02-20-2010 11:06 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BerntR (Post 71134)
So what do you think of Tigers remorse today?

I'll give it a B. The guts and the determination that went into it was A+, but the rest wasn't any good.

The performance didn't appear to come from the heart, and he seems to have a "I'll redesign my personality" approch to all of this which is not very trustworthy. Determination without reflection so to speak.

But he did take a clear position against his misconduct. Very few why's and absolutely no "I'll try"'s. If he falls back into bad habits it is highly unlikely that the press will hold anything back. I thought that was brave move. He is determined to conquer the challenge, but I don't think he has realized what he is facing yet.

I agree with this, but I will say one thing bothered me greatly. There is no doubt this was an unbelievably difficult, humbling experience for Tiger, but for a guy who can come across so sincere and natural when talking with the media, the robotic reading of a pre-prepared speech overshadowed the words coming out of his mouth for me. If he really wants to save his marriage, I hope the apology to his family was a lot more heartfelt.

EdZ 02-20-2010 02:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bambam (Post 71136)
I agree with this, but I will say one thing bothered me greatly. There is no doubt this was an unbelievably difficult, humbling experience for Tiger, but for a guy who can come across so sincere and natural when talking with the media, the robotic reading of a pre-prepared speech overshadowed the words coming out of his mouth for me. If he really wants to save his marriage, I hope the apology to his family was a lot more heartfelt.

Yep. Had he said the same thing without a script, in his normally smooth way I would have believed him more. As it is, he said what 'had' to be said. Crafted exactly the way it needed to be, and certainly not without a lot of input from others.

In a word - artificial.

Bagger Lance 02-20-2010 02:38 PM

Agree with the above, but I think Tiger and his handlers are super gun shy with the media. Any misstep in an ad-lib Q&A session could be taken way out of context by the media and either slow his come back or further damage his image.

The only way to prevent any further speculation or media frenzy is to do a "controlled" PR event as a first step in the come back. I don't expect Tiger to take part in any open Q&A until he plays and finishes strongly. If he decides to take a question, it will be a "canned" answer carefully crafted to avoid any misinterpretation.

I'm not happy about his timing and I know this was done purposely. I can only guess that doing it before the Tournament was crafted backwards in time from when he is going to play his first 2010 event. His PR folks have a 2010 plan laid out for him and this was the first step in what will be a very well organized coming out.

okie 02-20-2010 03:16 PM

Redshirt's Five Year Plan
 
I could not hear a word he said, what he has become thundered too loud! He should have chopped up an onion before going on! This apology can only be judged by the 20/20 of hindsight, say 5 years from now. Good luck to Eldrick and Siddhartha!

mrodock 02-20-2010 03:24 PM

I really did not see Tiger as artificial. I actually thought he sounded extremely contrite. Yes he was reading something that he undoubtedly got a lot of help in writing (perhaps he didn't even write a word), but he genuinely sounded as though he regretted his behavior. I absolutely did not expect the Tiger robot to get choked up, perhaps it is a new setting on the upgraded model.

In the interest of full disclosure, I didn't plan on watching the press conference, and I actually watched it a few hours later on youtube after hearing that he didn't sound awful. I was pleasantly surprised, particularly what I perceived as a heartfelt close--where he essentially said he was very grateful for people believing in him before, and he hopes that people can find the space in their heart to believe in him again. He may not have written it, but he sounded very sincere to me.

I think he really does understand that he will never be looked at the same way again. And wants sincerely to become the person we thought he was. As far as his comment that it isn't what you achieve, but what you overcome . . . I can't get behind that statement. I found it a bit ridiculous, seemingly suggesting that the pain and suffering he put his family through can put HIM in a position to be more victorious in life. From here he should be thinking about becoming a good person, not about grandiosity--perhaps the very thing that was his undoing.

golfguru 02-20-2010 08:52 PM

For a fellow who ruled the world, few will be able to grasp the mental implosion that he has, is and will continue to face. He may well not have been able to 'think, speak and be capable of doing' the question time circus yet.

Plenty of sports people, polies etc have been in his situation but none have fallen so far. Guilty as charged all of them.

Critics can go him for his past behaviour but guessing where his is in terms of dealing with his personal crisis, if he meant it or not, is just that. Everyone who listened to his speech will have taken a 'view into the how they heard it.' That is a human trait of 'how we know what isn't so' and as such means no matter what or how he said what he did, our perception of his words will have been that of 'he meant it' or 'what a put on.' Glass half empty or half full?

To hell with golf. His kids need him to grow into a better man and be a real role model. Recovery from stupidity is not for just Tiger, it's for his entire family. Let's hope he has great help and the resolve needed. If he succeeds there is hope for ALL families who fall into an abyss.

GPStyles 02-21-2010 02:01 PM

Well said Guru, I agree that we all will interpret what he said differently and have a preconceived idea of it anyway.

For what its worth, I think the entire thing stank.

Sally Jenkins captured it perfectly for me:

"Sorry, but I didn't buy it. The public Tiger Woods has always been artificial, but never has he seemed more waxen than in his so-called public apology. Here's the problem: Woods and his handlers staged a fake news conference to apologize for being fake.

To these ears, it was stilted and rehearsed to the point of insincerity. The pauses and the meaningful gazes into the camera were so cringingly long you began to suspect his script read, "lengthy pause for meaningful gaze into camera." Woods is no doubt genuinely contrite for cheating on his wife, but his 13 1/2 -minute speech before a controlled audience came off like an obligatory gated checkpoint that he clocked through on his way back to the golf course."

O.B.Left 02-21-2010 05:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GPStyles (Post 71162)
Well said Guru, I agree that we all will interpret what he said differently and have a preconceived idea of it anyway.

For what its worth, I think the entire thing stank.

Sally Jenkins captured it perfectly for me:

"Sorry, but I didn't buy it. The public Tiger Woods has always been artificial, but never has he seemed more waxen than in his so-called public apology. Here's the problem: Woods and his handlers staged a fake news conference to apologize for being fake.

To these ears, it was stilted and rehearsed to the point of insincerity. The pauses and the meaningful gazes into the camera were so cringingly long you began to suspect his script read, "lengthy pause for meaningful gaze into camera." Woods is no doubt genuinely contrite for cheating on his wife, but his 13 1/2 -minute speech before a controlled audience came off like an obligatory gated checkpoint that he clocked through on his way back to the golf course."


Is he on his way back to the golf course? Im not so sure. It'd be a big loss for him, given where the majors are this year. Perhaps its Karma?

EdZ 02-21-2010 06:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by O.B.Left (Post 71165)
Is he on his way back to the golf course? Im not so sure. It'd be a big loss for him, given where the majors are this year. Perhaps its Karma?

I will be shocked if he doesn't play the U.S. Open at Pebble.

If I had to guess right now, he'll play at Arnie's event and the Master's.

That said, I'll also be surprised if he plays more than 10 events in 2010.

GPStyles 02-22-2010 05:52 AM

I asked Kevin Hogan, a renowned Body Language Expert (he made his name by getting right that Clinton was lying about Monica) what he thought of Tiger's statemnet. This is his reply to me.

his apology was sincere. that doesn't exonerate previous behavior, nor does it predict future behavior

looking into his mothers eyes, he was ashamed of himself and clearly sorry for causing the mess

his family was experiencing


So we know he was sorry but will he change his ways? The fact that he has to go back for treatment suggests this is a bigger problem than we may have believed.

I was reading over at Geoff Shackleford today and this is what Dan Jenkins wrote a few weeks back, again, I think he is right on the money:

Life as Tiger has known it is over. His reputation is ruined, possibly forever. His name that once meant mastery over competitive golf now invokes cringes, giggles and all the Internet jokes you want to pass along.

Sure, he can come back and even win again, if he man's up, but if he does he will only be a hero to the "you-da-man" and "get-in-the-hole" crowd. And I can't imagine him coming back as a "humbled man." That wouldn't be the owner of a yacht insultingly named Privacy, the guy the press has still slobbered over for these past 12 years.

BerntR 02-22-2010 12:15 PM

He seemed sincere to me too, but I don't think he knows what he's up against. Tiger is "spoiled" with the ability to learn every trick in golf and invent some new. But changing personality and life style is much harder than changing the golf swing.

I don't share the pessimistic view about his future though. If he pulls it off he will get a better life outside the course. People will respect him as they used to and love him even more. But this will not happen overnight, and it is not a given that he succeeds either.

JerryG 02-22-2010 02:30 PM

I watched it and was terribly uncomfortable throughout.
It reminded me of a high school student trying to give a speech on something that he had rehearsed, just didn't quite pull it off for the A, but the teacher appreciated the fact that he made the effort.
When I think of how insulated this fellow has become over the past 15 years I cannot help but wonder about some basic trust issues that may require a great deal of work to get resolved. Other areas of development are all based on basic trust. This could be a very long process and there is the possibility we may not see him in competition for quite some time.
I was bothered this summer when I saw him with his caddy on a practice day at the PGA. When other players would hob nob between shots and have some give and take around the short game practice area, Tiger and Steve were alone. Other players made effort at some social banter with him, but Tiger's responses were terse and cut off further discussion.
I really think there is much more underlying all of this and hope he can come through this as a human being. Golf is of very little importance at this point.


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