I have sent that interview to hundreds of members....I have a sent email that I sent you the interview unless you made a mistake in the address you gave me.
I just sent another copy....
mrose,
When you get it, PM Bambam, and he will tell you how to get it to him. Then, we'll put it up for all to read.
I have now spent a lot of time trying out TT's "right arm throw" action.
I agree with you on one critical point - that it must start with an arm action and not a lower body action. TT's throw action is to throw the clubshaft "down-and-out" on the plane and to get the clubshaft moving down-and-out towards the ball before the body moves. I agree that the body must move secondarily/reactively to the throw. I can also understand how the body musn't move before the throw because that will predispose to throwing the club out in an OTT manner.
There is one major technical flaw in TT's description. He talks of uncocking both wrists in the throw action - activated by the right forearm. However, the right wrist never cocks in the backswing, it only bends backwards (dorsiflexes) - because the right arm flying wedge is always at a right angle to the left arm flying wedge at the top of the backswing. Therefore, when TT states that one throws the club from the top, the right wrist cannot uncock because it was never cocked up at any time point during the backswing. TT demonstrates a right arm throw action - using only his right arm - and it looks like he is uncocking his right wrist in an ulnar direction. However, that is not technically possible in a full golf swing - because if the flat left wrist is uncocking "on plane" and the right arm flying wedge is right-angled opposed to the uncocking left arm flying wedge, then the right wrist must perform an action that is 90 degrees opposed to the "on plane" uncocking motion of the left arm flying wedge. That obviously cannot be a right wrist uncocking motion. So, TT is wrong on two technical accounts - i) the right wrist never cocks upwards during the backswing and ii) any right wrist action must be at right angles to the down-and-out planar movement of the uncocking left arm flying wedge (uncocking left wrist). That right wrist action (if it occurred) would therefore have to be a palmar flexion action, and I suspect that even you wouldn't recommend that the right wrist should actively palmar flex in a swinger's action. Or would you?
I have now spent a lot of time trying out TT's "right arm throw" action.
I agree with you on one critical point - that it must start with an arm action and not a lower body action. TT's throw action is to throw the clubshaft "down-and-out" on the plane and to get the clubshaft moving down-and-out towards the ball before the body moves. I agree that the body must move secondarily/reactively to the throw. I can also understand how the body musn't move before the throw because that will predispose to throwing the club out in an OTT manner.
There is one major technical flaw in TT's description. He talks of uncocking both wrists in the throw action - activated by the right forearm. However, the right wrist never cocks in the backswing, it only bends backwards (dorsiflexes) - because the right arm flying wedge is always at a right angle to the left arm flying wedge at the top of the backswing. Therefore, when TT states that one throws the club from the top, the right wrist cannot uncock because it was never cocked up at any time point during the backswing. TT demonstrates a right arm throw action - using only his right arm - and it looks like he is uncocking his right wrist in an ulnar direction. However, that is not technically possible in a full golf swing - because if the flat left wrist is uncocking "on plane" and the right arm flying wedge is right-angled opposed to the uncocking left arm flying wedge, then the right wrist must perform an action that is 90 degrees opposed to the "on plane" uncocking motion of the left arm flying wedge. That obviously cannot be a right wrist uncocking motion. So, TT is wrong on two technical accounts - i) the right wrist never cocks upwards during the backswing and ii) any right wrist action must be at right angles to the down-and-out planar movement of the uncocking left arm flying wedge (uncocking left wrist). That right wrist action (if it occurred) would therefore have to be a palmar flexion action, and I suspect that even you wouldn't recommend that the right wrist should actively palmar flex in a swinger's action. Or would you?
Jeff.
Jeff,
Trust me Tommy doesn't cock the right wrist on the backswing. Nor does he try to uncock the right and left wrist at the beginning of the downswing (he karate chops with the right forearm...re-read the last paragraph of 7-3, with that karate chopping action he won't uncock that right wrist, it will stay bent and level because Tommy has trained himself to execute the Magic of the Right Forearm properly.). However, the right and left wrist go to an uncocked position post impact. Ya got to put his instruction into context...which you failed to do. At this point, I recommend you re-watch the whole Chapter series then watch the whole Letter series....you're getting close to figuring it out. I wouldn't stop. You'll start to see how good Tommy is at getting a golfer to use his right arm for swinging and hitting without generating a throw-away condition.
DG
Last edited by Delaware Golf : 12-01-2008 at 01:10 AM.
. . . at the beginning of the downswing (he karate chops with the right forearm...
DG,
The first three Sections of the Downstroke are Start Down (8-7), Downstroke (8-8 ) and Release (8-9).
The Action you describe is the Right Arm Throw (10-20-B). It is a defined Stroke Pattern Component (#20) Variation used to Trigger the Release of the Power Package. Accordingly, it is employed at Release (8-9), not at the "beginning of the downswing" (8-7).
You do your man a disservice to continue to assert otherwise.
The first three Sections of the Downstroke are Start Down (8-7), Downstroke (8-8 ) and Release (8-9).
The Action you describe is the Right Arm Throw (10-20-B). It is a defined Stroke Pattern Component (#20) Variation used to Trigger the Release of the Power Package. Accordingly, it is employed at Release (8-9), not at the "beginning of the downswing" (8-7).
You do your man a disservice to continue to assert otherwise.
I'm doing a disservice.....you're the one with Tom Tomasello demonstrating it on video in the gallery of this site.
Lynn....you need to watch the videos of Tommy....eventhough he is throwing/karate chopping from the top the clubhead is not going into it's release orbit. I believe that's why we have seen a change in the release component in the 6th to 7th edition....where the change went from 10-24-B to 10-24-E (even on your first phone call to Homer....Homer told Tommy to concentrate on Longitudinal acceleration...it's lengthwise acceleration). It's an automatic release. Watch letter series #2 video..you can't be a good student if you don't watch the instruction!!!
DG
Last edited by Delaware Golf : 12-01-2008 at 01:54 AM.
Yoda - In defense of DG's position, I cannot understand how you can infer that TT's "right arm throw" action should start with a 8-7 start down move. I can understand a pivot-driven swing starting with a 8-7 start down move and that the right arm throw is only used to trigger the release of the power package. However, TT specifically states that one must start the downswing with a "right arm throw action" that throws the clubshaft down-and-out onto the plane before the body moves. TT also specifically states that one should get the "feeling" of getting the clubhead past the left thigh before the body moves. Of course, that's not possible, but I cannot understand TT's intent - which is to make the body reactive to the throw, and that it should respond secondarily to the throw action - rather than preceding the throw action (ala Ben Hogan).
DG
My understanding of a karate chop action is an action where one drives the forearm down in such a manner that the wrist will uncock in the plane of the forearm motion, which means that the forearm movement must be in an ulnar direction. That's what the left forearm does during TT's right arm throw action where the clubshaft is thrown down-and-out onto the plane. However, the right forearm is 90 degrees opposed to the left arm flying wedge which means that the right forearm must move in a direction where the ventral aspect of the right forearm (front of the right forearm) is thrown down-and-out. In that sense, the motion of the right forearm cannot be correctly described as a karate chop action.
Yoda - In defense of DG's position, I cannot understand how you can infer that TT's "right arm throw" action should start with a 8-7 start down move. I can understand a pivot-driven swing starting with a 8-7 start down move and that the right arm throw is only used to trigger the release of the power package. However, TT specifically states that one must start the downswing with a "right arm throw action" that throws the clubshaft down-and-out onto the plane before the body moves. TT also specifically states that one should get the "feeling" of getting the clubhead past the left thigh before the body moves. Of course, that's not possible, but I cannot understand TT's intent - which is to make the body reactive to the throw, and that it should respond secondarily to the throw action - rather than preceding the throw action (ala Ben Hogan).
First, there is no TGM defense of DG's position.
Second, since you provided no quote or reference regarding my "inference", I can only presume that you are referring to my Post #120 above. That being the case, I clearly stated that the Release Trigger is employed at -- gasp! -- the Release (8-9) and not at Start Down (8-7).
Third, as far as Tom Tomasello and what he taught is concerned, I could care less, except that I am growing weary of correcting misconceptions either taught by him or promoted as being taught by him.
I'm doing a disservice.....you're the one with Tom Tomasello demonstrating it on video in the gallery of this site.
Lynn....you need to watch the videos of Tommy....eventhough he is throwing/karate chopping from the top the clubhead is not going into it's release orbit. I believe that's why we have seen a change in the release component in the 6th to 7th edition....where the change went from 10-24-B to 10-24-E (even on your first phone call to Homer....Homer told Tommy to concentrate on Longitudinal acceleration...it's lengthwise acceleration). It's an automatic release. Watch letter series #2 video..you can't be a good student if you don't watch the instruction!!!
DG,
Your post has about as many confused concepts as it does lines, and I refuse to waste my time correcting them. I will, however, expose (and correct) the most egregious error relevant to this thread.
The Basic Stroke Patterns (12-1-0 / Drive [Radial] Loading and 12-2-0 / Drag [Longitudinal] Loading) were introduced with the 4th Editon. The Right Arm Throw (10-20-B) was the designated Release Trigger (Component #20) for Drive Loading and the Left Wrist Throw (10-20-E) was the designated Variation for Drag Loading. THAT HAS NOT CHANGED! Not from the 4th to the 5th editions. Not from the 5th to the 6th editions. And certainly not from the 6th to the 7th editions.
In fact, in ALL the Stroke Patterns of ALL seven editions, NEVER ONCE has the Right Arm Throw been associated with Longitudinal Loading. The truth is that it has ALWAYS been associated with DRIVE Loading.
DG, your continued blatant disregard for The Golfing Machine as written by Homer Kelley and studied by Authorized Instructors and interested amateurs around the world is inconsistent with the mission of this website. Given your 'time in grade', to say that I am disappointed is an understatement. If these outrageous (and seemingly deliberate) inaccuracies continue, my only recourse will be to limit your posts to a dedicated thread prefaced by my own Caveat Emptor warning.
Your post has about as many confused concepts as it does lines, and I refuse to waste my time correcting them. I will, however, expose (and correct) the most egregious error relevant to this thread.
The Basic Stroke Patterns (12-1-0 / Drive [Radial] Loading and 12-2-0 / Drag [Longitudinal] Loading) were introduced with the 4th Editon. The Right Arm Throw (10-20-B) was the designated Release Trigger (Component #20) for Drive Loading and the Left Wrist Throw (10-20-E) was the designated Variation for Drag Loading. THAT HAS NOT CHANGED! Not from the 4th to the 5th editions. Not from the 5th to the 6th editions. And certainly not from the 6th to the 7th editions.
In fact, in ALL the Stroke Patterns of ALL seven editions, NEVER ONCE has the Right Arm Throw been associated with Longitudinal Loading. The truth is that it has ALWAYS been associated with DRIVE Loading.
DG, your continued blatant disregard for The Golfing Machine as written by Homer Kelley and studied by Authorized Instructors and interested amateurs around the world is inconsistent with the mission of this website. Given your 'time in grade', to say that I am disappointed is an understatement. If these outrageous (and seemingly deliberate) inaccuracies continue, my only recourse will be to limit your posts to a dedicated thread prefaced by my own Caveat Emptor warning.
Wow....I wish I could say more...but this is your website and I'm you sure you would delete my response. Did you and Tommy have a falling out. I can't believe you were friends at the end.
Your post has about as many confused concepts as it does lines, and I refuse to waste my time correcting them. I will, however, expose (and correct) the most egregious error relevant to this thread.
The Basic Stroke Patterns (12-1-0 / Drive [Radial] Loading and 12-2-0 / Drag [Longitudinal] Loading) were introduced with the 4th Editon. The Right Arm Throw (10-20-B) was the designated Release Trigger (Component #20) for Drive Loading and the Left Wrist Throw (10-20-E) was the designated Variation for Drag Loading. THAT HAS NOT CHANGED! Not from the 4th to the 5th editions. Not from the 5th to the 6th editions. And certainly not from the 6th to the 7th editions.
In fact, in ALL the Stroke Patterns of ALL seven editions, NEVER ONCE has the Right Arm Throw been associated with Longitudinal Loading. The truth is that it has ALWAYS been associated with DRIVE Loading.
DG, your continued blatant disregard for The Golfing Machine as written by Homer Kelley and studied by Authorized Instructors and interested amateurs around the world is inconsistent with the mission of this website. Given your 'time in grade', to say that I am disappointed is an understatement. If these outrageous (and seemingly deliberate) inaccuracies continue, my only recourse will be to limit your posts to a dedicated thread prefaced by my own Caveat Emptor warning.
Wow....I wish I could say more...but this is your website and I'm you sure you would delete my response. Did you and Tommy have a falling out. I can't believe you were friends at the end.
Even before Tommy shook Homer's hand....he had 48 hours worth of phone conversations on audio tape. Wow....must have been a wealth of knowledge in those 48 hours let alone the 8 12 hour days that he spent with Homer in his master class that he also caught on audio tape. I really don't know how Tommy could've have gone wrong. And even Golf Illustrated interviewed him...something good must have been happening in those Swinging, Hitting and Advanced schools. I'll let the members of this forum be the judge. Oh, btw, a number of the top University Golf Coachs studied with Tommy at his Myrtle Beach studio....even sent complementry notes after their instruction. Go figure....
GI:What happens to the shots of a player who executes these moves?
Tomasello: The player will immediately hit the ball higher and straighter, and substantially longer. The flight pattern will be dead straight to its apex, with the ball falling a touch left or drawing fractionally as it descends.
Imagine that...surely none of us want that.
DG
Last edited by Delaware Golf : 12-01-2008 at 09:13 PM.
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