Active pivot versus reactive pivot

[Jeff]

OB Left

The dancer performing the horizontal eight dance certainly has hula hula flexibility.

What drill would you recommend for a golfer who has had spinal fusion surgery where all the lumbar vertebra were fused together preventing any rotary movement at the level of each lumbar vertebra? How can that golfer perform an active pivot golf swing that requires a moderate level of hula hula flexibility?

Jeff.

[Yoda]

The dancer performing the horizontal eight dance certainly has hula hula flexibility.

What drill would you recommend for a golfer who has had spinal fusion surgery where all the lumbar vertebra were fused together preventing any rotary movement at the level of each lumbar vertebra?

I would recommend a seat directly opposite the dancer, a stiff drink -- just say "no" to the little umbrellas -- and an active #1 Accumulator (bending and straightening right elbow).

[Jeff]

Yoda

Could you please expand on these statements-:

"The Body still 'sets' -- at the very least -- and the Arms and Hands
'Deliver'."

I don't know what you are implying.

Also, look at Shawn Clement swinging his arms back-and-forth in this sequence.

Do you think that the pivot is causing the arms to move, or does he simply swing his arms back-and-forth while his body reacts to the motion of the swinging club?

Thanks,

Jeff.

[Yoda]

Yoda

Could you please expand on these statements-:

"The Body still 'sets' -- at the very least -- and the Arms and Hands
'Deliver'."

I don't know what you are implying.

You've got to get off your right side.

[Yoda]

Yoda

Also, look at Shawn Clement swinging his arms back-and-forth in this sequence.

Do you think that the pivot is causing the arms to move, or does he simply swing his arms back-and-forth while his body reacts to the motion of the swinging club?

Regarding Swing #1: For all the talk about "gravity", Shawn's Pivot is clearly delivering his unexpended Power Package into Release. Both in his prep and in the actual Stroke itself. All this with his 'Right Heel Down' homage to Moe Norman. Hey, Shawn's a Canadian, and I appreciate it. Looks good!

Regarding Swing #2: The prep for this swing shows exactly what an 'Arms and Hands leading, Body lagging' Stroke looks like. Powerless Throwaway. Ugh!
it.
Regarding Swing #3: Beware blind golfers. Especially those who want to play for big money . . . on their own course . . . at midnight!

[12 piece bucket]

Jeff . . . . look at this motion . . . it's won major smackers and a couple of majors . . . doesn't get his arm way in or up on the backstroke . . . Can probably beat all but 1% or maybe even 1/10% of the members on this website.

notice where his hands are at his top . . . just in of his torso . . . but he really releases #4 and he doesn't do much rotating at all . . . just kinda dippy slides it thru there . . . keeps it pretty much on the elbow plane the whole swing. You can get to his top . . . just take your arms in as much as you can without the left arm breaking down . . . AND TURN YOUR HIPS. Short arm swing = gooooooood. All that elbow releasing stuff is tough to return to the same spot every time.

[Yoda]

And check that Left Wrist / Clubshaft Lean at Impact!

[Jeff]

Yoda

I agree - the body must set.

When I describe a reactive pivot swing, I am simply describing an arm swing with a body set (the body falls forward before the arms swing the club through the impact zone). In other words, there is a pelvis shift left-laterally that happens before the arms swing down through the impact zone, but the pelvic motion doesn't pull the arms down. The arms swing down independently while the lower body is independently shifting left-laterally. That's what I perceive Shawn Clement is doing in his swing. He uses float loading and then simply uses his arms to pull the club down to the ball. While the arms are pulling the club down (event number 1) the pelvis is shifting left laterally (event number 2) and the final swing is a coordination of two independent movements (that are not causally connected). In an active pivot action swing, the pivot actually activates the downward movement of the left arm via the kinetic sequence. The left arm is catapulted off the chest wall by the pivot (pivot-activated release of PA#4) and not independently pulled down by arm/shoulder girdle muscles (arm-activated release of PA#4). In other words, in a pivot active swing action, the pivot causally causes the left arm to swing down to impact; while in a reactive pivot swing action there are two independent body actions that are time-coordinated.

12PB

Thanks for the link to the Allen Doyle swing video. I must try and mimic his swing actions. I love experimenting with different golf swing methods.

Jeff.

[12 piece bucket]

Yoda

I agree - the body must set.

When I describe a reactive pivot swing, I am simply describing an arm swing with a body set (the body falls forward before the arms swing the club through the impact zone). In other words, there is a pelvis shift left-laterally that happens before the arms swing down through the impact zone, but the pelvic motion doesn't pull the arms down. The arms swing down independently while the lower body is independently shifting left-laterally. That's what I perceive Shawn Clement is doing in his swing. He uses float loading and then simply uses his arms to pull the club down to the ball. While the arms are pulling the club down (event number 1) the pelvis is shifting left laterally (event number 2) and the final swing is a coordination of two independent movements (that are not causally connected). In an active pivot action swing, the pivot actually activates the downward movement of the left arm via the kinetic sequence. The left arm is catapulted off the chest wall by the pivot (pivot-activated release of PA#4) and not independently pulled down by arm/shoulder girdle muscles (arm-activated release of PA#4). In other words, in a pivot active swing action, the pivot causally causes the left arm to swing down to impact; while in a reactive pivot swing action there are two independent body actions that are time-coordinated.

12PB

Thanks for the link to the Allen Doyle swing video. I must try and mimic his swing actions. I love experimenting with different golf swing methods.

Jeff.

Jeff . . . . I think there is some validity to what you have said above . . . . regarding independent arm motion and blasting off . . . Mr. Kelley distinguished between pivot and non-pivot delivery.

I would say that regardless of whether you choose to blast the arm off the chest or move it independently . . .the CRITICAL piece is that you do it in such away that the HANDS STAY ON THE SELECTED PLANE.

That is one problem I have when people refer to the left arm being "blasted off the chest" . . . well ok fine . . . but WHERE is the left arm blasted? Homer said that if he had to retitle the book he would have called it Plane G.O.L.F. One of the problems that I still struggle with as a swinger is actually blasting the arm in a way that it throws it out over the plane. You can simply spin the shoulders into the #4 pressure point pinning the left arm and NEVER RELEASE #4 . . . which results in a plane shift and bent plane line.

Homer said "accumulators have to release" . . . and they ideally release in such a way that the hands and the club stay on plane. At the top of the swing with startdown there is some "independence" I think with the hips sliding and tilting the axis and #4 releasing to keep the hands ON PLANE. My first introduction to the Golfing Machine was the Ben Doyle tapes which maybe I didn't understand or misrepresent but that navel seek elbow deal with major deeeeep pitch IS NOT RELEASING #4 OR #1 and causes I host of problems that I still struggle with (bobbing, underplane, flashing clubface, . . . ). Not good. Somehow you have to pivot AND GET THE HANDS GOING DOWN THE FACE OF THE PLANE. Monitor it all . ..

[Hennybogan]

"I'll say it again. The fairway gets to be a lonely place." AD