As I said...the reference point for the Plane Line is the Target Line. Variance to the vertical angle of the plane does not change the location of the Plane Line. As for the rest of your questions...they are good ones. I guess you'll have to wait for the book. The point of this post was simply to share a video of a stroke which traces a straight, square Plane Line.....not to explain everything that I know about the golf stroke.
As I said...the reference point for the Plane Line is the Target Line. Variance to the vertical angle of the plane does not change the location of the Plane Line. As for the rest of your questions...they are good ones. I guess you'll have to wait for the book. The point of this post was simply to share a video of a stroke which traces a straight, square Plane Line.....not to explain everything that I know about the golf stroke.
Sorry . . . i thought you were saying this was THE ideal plane angle . . . misunderstood . . . apologies . . . can you field this one though? What is the impact on the HSP and Angle of Attack as the plane angles go from "steep" to "flatter" if other variables are held constant (not sure the can)?
Sorry . . . i thought you were saying this was THE ideal plane angle . . . misunderstood . . . apologies . . . can you field this one though? What is the impact on the HSP and Angle of Attack as the plane angles go from "steep" to "flatter" if other variables are held constant (not sure the can)?
No problem. Again, the HSP (Plane Line) is not affected by a change to the vertical angle of the plane, either steeper or flatter. The Attack Angle will depend on WHERE impact is made on the plane. But, if impact is made at the same distance before Low Point, then the Attack Angle will be more descending when the plane is closer to vertical (steeper).
No problem. Again, the HSP (Plane Line) is not affected by a change to the vertical angle of the plane, either steeper or flatter. The Attack Angle will depend on WHERE impact is made on the plane. But, if impact is made at the same distance before Low Point, then the Attack Angle will be more descending when the plane is closer to vertical (steeper).
EDIT . . . I have been corrected . . . HSP is just the Machine version of the plane line . . . got it now . . . duh . . . sorry . . . .
Now . . . rephrase . . . does track man have any data on relationship of angle of attack and club head path as the plane angle goes from "steeper" to "flatter" . . .
Thanks Mr. Graham . . . for righting my ship!
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Last edited by 12 piece bucket : 10-26-2010 at 10:24 PM.
Steeper plane (say 60*5 iron) = less out = less plane line rotation left to zero out path and face (if the ball is not a T)Flatter plane = more out therefore more plane line rotation to zero out the path and face.
Steeper plane (say 60*5 iron) = less out = less plane line rotation left to zero out path and face (if the ball is not a T)Flatter plane = more out therefore more plane line rotation to zero out the path and face.
Interesting Okie. Are you assuming the clubface is square to the Arc of Approach or true path before you rotate the plane?
Here's a Trackman diagram........all looks kinda familiar except some of their terminology is even weirder than ours. Something I previously thought to be impossible. Im with Homer on this name game......"Plane Angle" is a far better handle than Vertical Swing Plane. Maybe Im missing something however.
Yes. All of this is of course for the purpose of "zeroing out" any divergence between the path and the face, or hitting it straight (also assuming an accurate strike) It also helps explain my method of hitting straight shots, namely trying to hit a fade! To me it is a matter of learning how to hit it straight and then learn to aim it. To me the inside out cut shot achieves the same result. Took a beginner, taught him how to hit a little punch shot that initially was a push-slice. We worked on the club face angle (mainly by matching it up with the clubhead path. first push-fades, then finally just pushes. Next we just started to rotate everything to the left until the ball was on target. He had 3 polies over the course of 30 or so shots. I was disgusted! The face still gets away from him, and we are now moving the ball closer to low point and shallowing out his angle of attack as well as the path...which typical means less adjustment in terms of reorienting the plane line. I don't use the ever popular instruction of swinging left, I just trace the right plane line.
About the vertical/horizontal swing plane terminology. I agree that knowing what an elbow plane vs a turned shoulder plane is far more user friendly but Trackman measures these planes to the degree. Not because it is an earth shattering revelation to a player that their vertical swing plane with the driver is 45*, but because that number has a lot to do with the result of the shot. Wonder hogan looks like he was going to bruise his ribcage on the following through by the degree he ripped it left! Flatter swing plane (as I already mentioned) has more of an out nature, so to have the ball start on line he rotated his stuff left (even with a closed stance)Nicklaus on the hand was into bruising his chin on the backswing and hardly seems to be making any plane line adjustments (less out.)I do not know that the take on the d-plane is over here (I was on sabbatical!) but it squares up!
Last edited by okie : 11-19-2010 at 12:38 AM.
Reason: blah blah
Interesting Okie. Are you assuming the clubface is square to the Arc of Approach or true path before you rotate the plane?
Here's a Trackman diagram........all looks kinda familiar except some of their terminology is even weirder than ours. Something I previously thought to be impossible. Im with Homer on this name game......"Plane Angle" is a far better handle than Vertical Swing Plane. Maybe Im missing something however.
OB, the assumptions built into this depiction are everything. This makes me admire Moe Norman even more, which I did not think possible. Let's say that the Trackman is spot on in it's analysis. That is sort of a gratuitous achievement, isn't it?
The real issue is effectively putting the ball into the hole. To do so, a person must master themselves over time and to some extent, master time and it's effects. THAT IS A MUCH BIGGER DEAL!!
Ask yourself another question, how much straighter can a directional line be drawn and painted on my putter or driver? Let's say it's perfectly straight. So what? I'm quite crooked in a number of ways, lmao.
A basketball is perfectly round (almost). But there was only one M. Jordan.
And Tiger can use or not use any healing technique or spiritual "balance" he can find, and he's still not probably ever going to be who he was. So what?! Lace 'em up and grab those sticks, men! And don't forget to enjoy the scenery!
ICT
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HP, grant me the serenity to accept what I cannot change, the courage to change what I can, and the wisdom to know the difference. Progress and not perfection is the goal every day!
Last edited by innercityteacher : 11-19-2010 at 05:20 PM.
To me it is a matter of learning how to hit it straight and then learn to aim it. To me the inside out cut shot achieves the same result. Took a beginner, taught him how to hit a little punch shot that initially was a push-slice. We worked on the club face angle (mainly by matching it up with the clubhead path. first push-fades, then finally just pushes. Next we just started to rotate everything to the left until the ball was on target. He had 3 polies over the course of 30 or so shots. I was disgusted!
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