Anyone can chip in some ideas on the above topics?
What is the mechanical disadvantage vs. the advantage?
The pulley position between a Flip release and Snap release?
Both Pressure Points and Arc of Approach, are they actively employ in Flip Release?
Unlike other releases, in FLIP – let’s talk about the ball position and stance line
Or no one care to talk about the FLIP.
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I am not East Coast nor West Coast... I stick to the MIDLAND
Anyone can chip in some ideas on the above topics?
What is the mechanical disadvantage vs. the advantage?
The pulley position between a Flip release and Snap release?
Both Pressure Points and Arc of Approach, are they actively employ in Flip Release?
Unlike other releases, in FLIP – let’s talk about the ball position and stance line
Or no one care to talk about the FLIP.
i have been digging around for two weeks trying to learn aboout the flip release. i forund some info on david orr's site. he said there was very little tilt lused, it was a circular path delivery, used a wrist throw, and ells and michelson were flip releasers. there may be somethilng about a left arm delivery path with this too. help! thanks.
i have been digging around for two weeks trying to learn aboout the flip release. i forund some info on david orr's site. he said there was very little tilt lused, it was a circular path delivery, used a wrist throw, and ells and michelson were flip releasers. there may be somethilng about a left arm delivery path with this too. help! thanks.
I have had this marked as 'no clue' for 28 years. Homer could not describe it well and I can only guess.
I think it refers to a naturally messy kind of pivot that produces a burst of CF with a fast wrist and hand overtaking motion that looks flippy but holds to the definition of rhythm. The on plane flip release is the only geometrical element that would release early with short irons and later with long clubs and has to be adjusted with an open or closed stance.
Maybe this is the too simple explanation that I have been looking for these past for 28 years.
I dont know about ernie but certainly phil and vj have that look and phil especially could make the argument that it is a right arm swing...what phil and vj both suffer from are rhythm issues between the paddlewheel motions of both flying wedges
I dont know about ernie but certainly phil and vj have that look and phil especially could make the argument that it is a right arm swing...what phil and vj both suffer from are rhythm issues between the paddlewheel motions of both flying wedges
LOL yeah im suffering from students saying look at what VJ is doing, you said don't do that.
Anyone can chip in some ideas on the above topics?
What is the mechanical disadvantage vs. the advantage?
The pulley position between a Flip release and Snap release?
Both Pressure Points and Arc of Approach, are they actively employ in Flip Release?
Unlike other releases, in FLIP – let’s talk about the ball position and stance line
Or no one care to talk about the FLIP.
Oz,
I think, off plane delivery to on plane release.
10-24-F....Release is Triggered (7-20) by allowing the Arm Swing and or the Shoulder Turn to Swing the Hands per 10-24-E (Wrist Throw) automatically or deliberately and move the Clubhead to an Off Plane relation to the Arms so Centrifugal Force can accelerate the "Throw Out" action thus initiating (6-B-3-0).
How else could it be said (1-H). Loop the club flatter than you arms so CF has more effect on throw out. Like Sergio. How simple can it be. Maybe Hogan?
I have been teaching this to pullers for 10 years and it is the first thing I taught you Oz but didn't know it.
10-24-F....Release is Triggered (7-20) by allowing the Arm Swing and or the Shoulder Turn to Swing the Hands per 10-24-E (Wrist Throw) automatically or deliberately and move the Clubhead to an Off Plane relation to the Arms so Centrifugal Force can accelerate the "Throw Out" action thus initiating (6-B-3-0).
How else could it be said (1-H). Loop the club flatter than you arms so CF has more effect on throw out. Like Sergio. How simple can it be. Maybe Hogan?
I have been teaching this to pullers for 10 years and it is the first thing I taught you Oz but didn't know it.
Thanks for making me get The Book out again.
The incubator has been working for a long time.
After 24 years I think you have just about nailed this one. Thats why we call this part of the forum the Hatchery.
Keep in mind that even though Homer said "arms", its really the on-plane right forearm that we care about. So "off plane" is really about an off plane right forearm through the release interval.
I've seen photo's of Sergio, Phil, Hogan and others (nice company) who are below plane with the right forearm but have a lot of #3 accumulator angle so the clubshaft is still tracking on plane, even though it is closer to the hands plane, through impact. For these guys, the having rhythm with #3 accumulator roll is critical for a straight shot. The "flip" is not so much a left wrist bend action as a very fast roll action to "save" the shot. Allowing CF to take over clubhead roll compensates for the off plane right forearm. Its a compensation move and the player just has to allow it to happen.
I'm discussing the release interval and I believe you are talking about the start down period. One way or another, the pieces are starting to fall into place.
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Bagger
1-H "Because of questions of all kinds, reams of additional detail must be made available - but separately, and probably endlessly." Homer Kelly
Here is some text out of the third edition which were omitted in later editions.
"This is usually a subconscious procedure and is indicated by the inability of the player to hit well with all Clubs from a square stance. It faces the same problem of Club length that requires the Aiming Point procedures to move the Aiming Point fore or aft...So the Open and Closed stances are employed to vary the ball location in relation to the body to compensate for Clubshaft lengths...The Flip release is the result of the fact that the Right Arm (Accumulator #1) will start to straighten, naturally and automatically, at any point in the Downstroke that the Left Arm begins to move away from the chest - which it always must, sooner or later. Regardless of where this occurs, the players habitual Pivot procedure will bring the Hands, quite dependably, into impact position at the same point relative to the body."
(Bold mine)
Hence the requirement for open/closed stances unless the player can manipulate roll very well such as your average Tour caliber player. When you see VJ and Phil loose their right hand (Phil left) from the club through impact, they are effectively allowing their well educated lead wrist to have full control over the shot, even though their habitual pivot took their hands to the wrong impact location for the selected club and they ran out of right arm.
Homer goes on to say "There is little attempt to discuss Components and Variations in connection with this procedure, elsewhere in the book, because the only real differences are (1) the fixed hand location for Impact, and (2) the variable Plane Line for different length of Club."
The Flip release can be fast or lazy, the point is it is pivot dependent procedure. The hands are controlled by the pivot and impact occurs when the hands reach a certain habitual point relative to the body for every club. So if you are pulling your short clubs and pushing your long clubs, its a tipoff that you are flip releasing.
__________________
Bagger
1-H "Because of questions of all kinds, reams of additional detail must be made available - but separately, and probably endlessly." Homer Kelly
Thats why we call this part of the forum the Hatchery.
Hybrid Mode
